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postheadericon Travis County Propane price wars?

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A lot of the  neighborhoods in the Bee Cave area rely on community propane systems as  natural gas has never been piped this far out.  These systems are owned  and operated by companies like Allied Gas (previously Sonterra), Amerigas,  Ferrel Gas and others. 

 

Neighborhoods include:

  • Senna  Hills
  • Preserve at Barton Creek
  • Lake Pointe
  • Seven Oaks
  • Bella  Lago
  • The Preserve at Lakeway

These companies have a virtual monopoly on the  neighborhoods they "service".  Last year Sonterra Gas raised prices a  weighted average of 37% in a year when the average residential propane price  increased only 9% and, at the same time many customers went without any  propane service during the coldest days last winter.  

Naturally,  there is outrage.  Propane, unlike Natural Gas is not regulated by the  Texas Railroad Commission for price and service.  Several of the local  communities including Lake Pointe and Senna Hills have banded together to  lobby for regulation.  Per the TRRC, there are 75 of these community  propane systems in Texas, and 48 of them are in Travis county, so this  should be a campaign issue for the local candidates.

 

Interested parties can contact:

Chris Sallee

This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it  

512-263-1753

or join the Yahoo group HERE

Comments (9)
  • Ron Binkley  - Propane Wars
    My propane bills have been through the roof. From Nov 2009 through April 2010, I paid almost $2,200 in propane bills. I live by myself and only use what I think is minimal propane.

    Late spring I read an annoucement for a new propane company that opened on Debba Lane. I stopped in there to ask if propane was relugated by any state agency and was told The Texas Railroad Commission regulates them. I told the gentleman that I thought I might have a leak and he offered to come out and do a leak test. As I was leaving, I asked him how much he was charging per gallon for propane. He told me $2.15 a gallon.

    When I got home, I checked my last statement from Ferrell Gas and it blew me away. They were charging me $3.92 a gallon. I now have a new propane company! He also came out to my house and did the gas test. I had no leaks. I was just being ripped off.

    My new propane company is Absolute Propane. The man I spoke with is Thomas Rut. 266-7383

    We all need to review things like our cable TV, auto insurance, cell phone bills, etc at least once a year. It's easy for these kind of companies to slowly inch their charges up on us without us really paying much attention. I recently review all mentioned above and was able to lower every single one of them to the tune of about $125 a month collectively.

    Just food for thought!
  • Larry Fox  - Correction
    Sonterra was replaced by Alliant Gas which is divided between Dallas and San Antonio. The new owners were one of the communities served by Sonterra - Cordilleria Ranch subdivision in Boerne. They have started off by raising the rates 15% while the wholesale price of LP has fallen.

    Larry Fox
    President MUD #5 (Lake Pointe)
  • Chris Sallee  - Re: Ron's comment
    Ron, I think you have your own individual tank. You can get propane from more than 1 source. For people in the neighborhoods that are organizing, they are hooked into a central tank which is owned by a company that has a monopoly on the neighborhood. In many cases the poeple in these neighborhoods are deed restricted from even having their own tank. They have no options. And, the developers often participate in the revenue - they get a percentage off the top, of everyones' propane bills. The agreements between the developers are kept secret, and are not disclosed at the time of purchase. It is really dispicable and it should be illegal. That's why we are organizing to get propane regulated.
  • Chris Sallee  - Re: Larry Fox's comment
    Yes, the old stinkers (Sonterra) have been replaced by new stinkers (Allied Gas). The cause of the problems is that the laws allow these unregulated monopolies in the communities they "serve" and the developers get a cut! This is what happens whey you have unregulated monopolies!
  • LZ  - Overreacting, under educating
    The price of propane in community systems is very comparable with retail propane. In fact with some companies in the area the community propane customers have the same rate options as the normal retail customers. By being in a community system you do not have to take on the liability or burden of having your own propane tank. If you are really concerned about your price call your provider, they may have other options. Also, propane regardless of who provides it will ALWAYS be 3-4x more expensive then natural gas because they are just so different. I had propane in Colorado and this is all information a company will give you if you ASK before you purchase a home.
  • Chris Sallee  - Lots of education yields the same answer
    Propane is by far the most expensive way to heat your home. Btu for Btu, propane is 4x the cost of natural gas. The fact that natural gas raw material cost is much lower than propane seems to be the reason that people accept that their propane company's cost to deliver propane also dwarfs the cost the natural gas company charges for delivering natural gas. Let's take the situation for a single home, mine, on propane, versus another home, my friend's, on natural gas, for last month, for example. I used a lot less. Measured in cubic feet, I used about 1/4 of my friend, 400 cubic feet versus 1700 cubic feet. Propane has 2.5x the heat producing potential, but even so, I received only about half as much heat (btu's). My bill was $43.16. My friend's was $22.00. So, I paid twice as much for 1/2 half as much heat. If I am an average customer for propane, and my friend is typical for natural gas, and you take the time to look at the amount of money the propane company and natural gas company have left over after serving us, you find that, after subtracting the cost of their raw materials which is the Henry Hub price for natural gas, and Mont Belvieu price for propane, the propane company has 2-3x the amount of money left compared with the natural gas company after subtracting what they paid for their raw materials. So, either the propane company is making a lot more money per customer, or they are much more inefficient in delivering propane compared to the profit/efficiency in delivering natural gas. Overall, just accepting the price of propane because propane is more expensive to create, since the wholesale price is higher, and not challenging the propane providers to deliver propane efficiently, is just not looking deeply enough into the situation, something the propane providers are probably very happy to have their customers do.
  • Lz
    Chris, I'm not saying you're wrong. I understand your frustration and it's unfortunate that your provider has been so unhelpful. Propane functions differently then natural gas, so the amount of natural gas it takes to heat your home is about double what it takes propane to do, it's clear you understand that. Because propane is a manufactured product that must be imported, exported and is far more vulnerable in price compared to natural gas, the price will be...yes...higher. The fact of the matter is there are other companies out there treating their customers as they would a customer with their own tank because they heard their concerns. Also, regulation may only just effect the margin providers receive, so the price will still fluctuate. Not all propane providers are the same, I was used to mom & pop shops who really care about all your concerns, and now I'm with a bigger company who have been more than willing to answer all my questions about their business practices. Call around, see what other community providers have to say.
  • Chris Sallee  - hmmm
    Lz,
    I agree and I understand. I wish I was doing business with a mom and pop company that really cared. Also, definitely, propane is refined so it will always be more expensive than natural gas. But, on the other hand, if you call around, as I have, and talk to people who have been privy to the dealings of these "monopolies with no price regulation," which are the companies that own the central propane gas distribution systems, you would hear about secret agreements, like in Falconhead where the developer won't share the agreement he has with the propane company - residents aren't allowed to see it. And in other communities you will find that you can see actual documents proving developers took 10% or 20% of the propane revenues for all of the homes in a neighborhood, in perpetuity, such as in Senna Hills, and Lake Pointe. And you would see that there have been tank fires as in Senna Hills, and service interruptions in the coldest parts of the winter last winter as in Senna Hills, and 5 ownership changes in the last 10 years, and employees of these companies that don't know where the shutoff valves are to turn off the propane when it is blowing wide open into the air beside a home as happened in Lake Pointe. And, I don't think you would be as sure that these community providers are really good guys. My estimate is that regulation would lower the price 20-25%. Natural gas is 75% cheaper so it still doesn't get close, but I don't want to send my money to a bunch of wild, wild west operators who have monopolies with no price regulation and are possibly endangering lives with their incompetence and have a bunch of fat cat investors taking big slices of profit off the top. Please accept my invitation to join the Centexpropaneregulation group and i can give you access to many, many people and documents that will cause you to reevaluate your positiveness at least as far as these monopolies without price regulation. I repeat, Mom and Pop's are just fine with me. I wish we were dealing with a Mom and Pop. I really, really, really wish it.
  • Anonymous  - ProPain
    Agreed, regulation is the only answer, the problems are not only in Texas but all across this great nation. I'm a realtor and see the poor services and over charges all the time. I am relocation to Austin in the next three months and refused to have my home heated by propane, sure they charged me a penalty of $3,000.00 but I should see that savings in less then 2 years. The builder didn't get me.
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